I was on the #ubuntu-us-fl IRC channel recently, when one of my fellow geeks put forward an interesting theory: People are attracted to Apple products by a high price. The theory assumes that in our society people usually equate price with quality, and not always accurately. Today I decided to do a little price comparison. I gladly admit that I have a bias towards the Linux operating system, specifically the Ubuntu distribution. However, in this post I will try to let hopefully unbiased numbers speak for themselves, with the exception of my summary at the end.
Below I have the configurations and prices for four machines: an Apple Mac Pro, a Dell XPS 630, The Wild Dog performance desktop from System76, and finally a custom built machine with parts from Newegg (thanks to excid3 for the build specs). Though the machines are from four different OEMs (aka companies that build computers), I configured each to be as close as possible in specifications and performance.
Apple Mac Pro, $2,849.00
- Processor: One 2.66GHz Quad-Core Intel Xeon
- RAM: 8GB (4x2GB)
- Hard drive: 1TB 7200-rpm Serial ATA 3Gb
- Graphics card: NVIDIA GeForce GT 120 512MB
- DVD burner: One 18x SuperDrive
Dell XPS 630, $1,679
- Processor: Intel® Core™2 Q9550 (12MB,2.83GHz, 1333FSB) (Also a quad core)
- RAM: 8GB Dual Channel DDR2 SDRAM at 800MHz (4 DIMM)
- Hard drive: 1TB Performance RAID 0 (2 x 500GB SATA 3Gb/s 7200 RPM HDDs)
- Graphics card: SLi, Dual nVidia GeForce 9800GT 512MB
- DVD burner: 16X CD/DVD burner (DVD+/-RW) w/double layer write capability
System76 Wild Dog Performance Desktop, $1,089.00
- Processor: Quad Core Q6600 2.40 GHz FSB 1066 MHz L2 8 MB
- RAM: 8 GB – 4 x 2 GB – DDR3 – 1333 MHz
- Hard Drive: 1 TB SATA II 300Mbps – 7200 rpm 32 MB Buffer
- Graphics card: 512 MB ATI Radeon 4550 PCI-Express x16 GDDR3 (DVI, VGA, S-Video, DVI to HDMI, DVI to VGA)
- DVD burner: CD-RW / DVD-RW
Custom built machine, $608.90
Note: If you wanted Windows Vista on this machine (not recommended), just add $179.99 to the price. Also, the links to all the parts are listed below, seeing as there is a lot more customization that goes into a custom build.
- AMD Phenom 9600 Agena 2.3GHz Socket AM2+ 95W Quad-Core Processor Model HD960ZWCGDBOX – Retail
- Kingston HyperX 2GB 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 1066 Desktop Memory Model KHX8500D2/2G – Retail (x4)
- Antec earthwatts EA500 500W Continuous Power ATX12V v2.0 SLI Certified CrossFire Ready 80 PLUS Certified Active PFC Power … – Retail
- ASUS M4N78 Pro AM3/AM2+/AM2 NVIDIA GeForce 8300 HDMI ATX AMD Motherboard – Retail
- Western Digital Caviar Black WD1001FALS 1TB 7200 RPM SATA 3.0Gb/s 3.5″ Hard Drive – OEM
- NZXT HUSH Black SECC Steel/ Aluminum/ Plastic ATX Mid Tower Computer Case – Retail
- PLEXTOR 20X DVD Super Multi Qflix Drive Black SATA Model PX-806SA SW – Retail
Biased Summary
I’ll start off with the most obvious and least controversial conclusion: you’d be crazy not to get a custom built machine. Due to the geeky tendencies of this blog, most people reading this are likely to be fellow geeks. Any geek worth their weight in old CRT monitors can put that machine together. If however you are not a geek, surely you know someone who is. For $200 and a few hours to play with all the shiny parts, any geek would be glad to put this machine together for you, and you’d still be saving a huge amount of money.
Now for the slightly more controversial conclusions. I believe that a higher price does play a role in a person’s decision to buy a Mac. It is certainly not the only factor, since as far as OEM equipment goes, Apple is fairly nice. I agree that Apple has some very high quality hardware. However, the hardware in each of these machines is very similar, and all high quality, and yet the Apple machine is $1,170 more expensive than the second most expensive and yet very similar machine. You could even get any one of these machines and put OSX on it yourself if Apple would let you (or you felt like using The Pirate Bay).
Given the fact that all four machines are very similar, lets assume for a moment that the custom built machine represents the price each manufacturer pays to build their computer (not quite accurate, as the OEM’s save money by buying parts in bulk). This would mean that what you are really buying from an OEM is the convenience of having someone else put a computer together for you. That convenience costs you $2,240 if Apple builds it and $1,070 if Dell builds it. The lowest OEM service price is from System76, at $480, which is just over twice my recommended build price from the friendly neighborhood geek.
My numbers are certianly not perfect, especially since it is impossible to get an exactly identical machine from two OEMs. However, even after doing tweaking for any innacuracies in my calculations or configurations, I think your findings will be the same: all OEMs are expensive, but Apple is by far the most expensive.
I know that this is a topic may people are very passionate about. I welcome discussion and debate, but keep it polite, or your comment will be deleted.
hmm, this is what i’d compare this argument to…
i work at a car dealership, we sell volkswagens and Kias
you can get a very nicely equipped kia for like 13k with a 10 year 100k mile warrenty
to get the same in a VW is going to run closer to 20k+
and you only have a 4 year 50k mile warrenty
why would anyone in their right mind pay so much of a premium for the vw when in reality they are getting less of a warrenty and all the same options?
i think its generally because (this applies to mac vs pc too) of a better build quality, typically better design visually.
also i think the support on macs is a lot better than any pc. as long as you have applecare, you can just set up an appointment and typically same day goto the mac store and get your computer/ipod/iphone repaired.
I’ve addressed my take on the quality issue, so I won’t repeat it in this reply. However, you bring up a good point regarding their quality of customer service. Apple certainly has the best service of any big OEM I’ve ever seen. I’m still skeptical that providing this extra amount of service requires an extra $1,170 per computer. It would certainly raise prices, but that much? However, even if they do need that much extra for the service, why not sell service as an add-on option at the time of purchase (or a separate purchase later on). This would allow them to still provide the extra services that seem to be in significant demand, and yet complete with other OEMs on price. The only way I can think of that this approach would not work would be if the Apple marketing department was of the opinion that the higher price was a strategic marketing tool.
This article got me curious about something… running OS X on a PC. In fact, it is completely possible, though not really viable. Here is a video that gives a brief idea as to why.
http://video.yahoo.com/watch/2559506/7671856
I think that would depend upon your definition of the word “viable.” From a technical standpoint it is certainly viable, though you are best off making sure you design the system with OSX in mind. The guy in the video’s main point is that it is a violation of copyright, and a DMCA violation. I personally have no ethical dilemmas about infringing upon a government sanctioned time limited monopoly (copyright), as I think monopoly of any sort is unnecessary and destructive economically. I know that many people do have an ethical issue violating copyright, and I respect their decision in that. The DMCA violation though, I am whole-heartedly willing to do. The DMCA is an incredibly stupid law that violates our 1st Amendment rights.
That said, I tend to avoid anything with DRM in it, and only use Free / Open Source software.
On the other hand though, if you hold a Dell in your hands, then you hold a MacBook Pro in your hands, you can tangibly feel the build quality difference. I’ve used thinkpads, HP notebooks, Dell laptops and nothing touches the build quality and battery life of a MacBook Pro.
It’s also why I purchase German built vehicles over cheaper Japanese imports, …
Desktops are completely different though comparatively since you don’t carry them around with you. So I agree with your article if that’s the topic. I just think that laptop / notebooks are a totally different element..
The fact that you are talking about laptops throws another variable in the loop. However, assuming the pattern holds there, laptop hardware from Apple is going to be very simular to a comparable “pc” from a different OEM. This means that the main difference between machines is the case. I love a great case as much as the next geek, but I don’t love good cases enough to pay over $1,000 more for a computer.
Good points. I think building your own machine is a brilliant option and one that people who have a reasonable level of technical skills should do.
One problem with your analysis is that it is hardware centric, which is only 1/2 of the equation.
So for example: My wife has a high end Vista machine which is 20% more powerful than my Macbook Pro. However, my Macbook is faster on almost all accounts. My Macbook has also been more stable.
So unfortunately when analyzing hardware, we are not comparing apples to apples. (Pardon the pun). Also, less tangible things factor into the software equation such as end user experience, street cred, compatibility with specialised software packages and support.
From my point of view, the best value for money is to build a custom machine and put Linux on it. (or buy it with it already installed). The drawback of this scenario is that if you need to run specialised commercial software for your work or studies Linux can be limiting.
If Windows 7 turns out to be a bomb like Vista, I think we can expect to see another huge influx of people heading to Linux and Mac. In some ways I sort of hope that this is the case because I think that the growth of Linux will encourage software developers to target markets outside of Windows.
Of course the marketing out of Redmond indicates that Windows 7 is going to be awesome. My only gripe about this was that we heard this in the run up to Vista, so time will only tell.
Lastly, going back to your original premise, I believe that without doubt one of the elements that is fueling Apple growth is that it is a fashion statement right now particularly among youth. With this is the associated price point. Is it all fashion? No, but when many people buy an OSX machine, they aren’t that concerned about the fact that it runs on BSD Unix and it’s related benefits.
So it will be interested to see where the market heads. At least for the foreseeable future, this current generation that is growing up around iPods will probably be more Mac inclined than previous computing generations.
You bring up some good points. There is a reason that I did not factor in software, and that is because IMHO it is an insignificant part of the cost. For example, it might have cost M$ 10 million to make Vista. However, they sold hundreds of millions of copies to OEMs. If you estimate that each OEM pays MS $50 per license, then it probably costs Microsoft pennies to put it’s OS on any given machine.
Also, it is even harder to estimate the costs of putting OSX on a Mac, as you cannot get a Mac without their software. However, the ratios probably work simularly to how they work with Windows.
Finally, the first two OEM builds did include a copy of OSX and Vista respectively, so at least for the comparison between those two OS was a factor.
All the above comments are interesting. However, the key is where/how the parts are built. Same goes for cars. A KIA is built with crap parts by people who don’t give a crap. A VW is built by people who do give a crap and use GOOD parts.
Same goes for a macbook vs a dell. A macbook will be one of the few that last well beyond it’s useful life AND it will keep a high resale value because of that.
The moniker “You get what you pay for” does count here, but the proof is in the pudding.
You bring up a good point about quality of parts, but many of the parts in the Apple desktop can be found in the other desktops. The Nvidia graphics cards would be a good example. As far as product life spans, at least with these builds that would come down to the OS installed. The Mac with OSX would probably outlast the Dell Vista machine for example. Also, I suspect that the System76 machine with Ubuntu would last at least as long as the OSX machine. I’ve seen a few case studies to back this therory up (along with personal experience).
when i’m talking about service i’m talking about how helpful they are at the mac store. so its not like they can make that optional. haha.
1 year applecare warranty is included with all mac computers, the 3 year extended warranty is optional
One other issue about software influencing hardware decisions… I’m not a Macsnob that maintains that everything is better on a Mac. To the contrary, I’ve been a Windows user for many many years.
So with that in mind, I was needed to edit a video clip yesterday for YWAM England. I started on our Vista machine using Adobe’s Premier Elements. It was slow and clunky and in the end, it did not give me the kind of quality that I was looking for to upload it to YouTube. For some reason, Adobe’s presets for YouTube are awful.
The thing about Premier elements is that we had to buy it as a separate software add on. We did a lot of research and some argue that it is one of the best for the Windows market. It’s okay, but Adobe is obviously neglecting it to get people to upgrade to their professional package.
After fighting it for a bit, I finally put the video on my mac and within 5 minutes was able to achieve what I wanted and upload it to YouTube with iMovie. iMovie along with a number of other apps are included with every purchase of a Mac. There is no extra cost and the quality is really respectable.
Some other examples? For years, I have wanted to see decent multivideo conference support in things like Skype. iChat has had this feature implemented and until recently, their one to one video was better than Skype. (I am so looking forward to when Skype has multivideo!)
One more example… Time Machine (Apple’s backup). It’s the first user friendly detailed backup programme that I have see that works out of the box with no set up. I see that Genie is now coming up with something similar http://www.genie-soft.com/products/genie_timeline/default.html But the average computer user doesn’t have a good backup plan because many of the backup programmes are inadequate or too complicated to set up.
Are there alternatives to all of the above? Yes, but one of the things about Apple is that the software tends to be generally very, very good and works out of the box. To the techies, this is not appealing, even insulting and too confining, but for people like my mum, it is brilliant and the extra cost is worth it.
Again, value for money, Linux is light years ahead.
From a consumer perspective, compare customer service satisfaction from Dell to Apple.
Ouch.
http://www.macobserver.com/tmo/article/forrester_survey_shows_apple_tops_in_customer_service/
Forrester survey, April 17, 2009 is reporting:
Apple: 80%
Dell: 58%
People who are in the market to make a purchase do take this into account. Sprint is losing customers in the millions because of crappy customer service. Apple recognizes that, and takes advantage of this.
Michael Dell was pulled out of retirement to save the reputation, the CEO for sprint is now doing his lame ass “hip” commercials also for the same reason.
Cost is only one aspect of technology to people these days, how they are treated pays its weight in gold.
I realise most of the people reading this “myself included” understand the value and cost savings in building our own rigs. But for the common consumer, who doesn’t know the difference between a mobo, proc, RAM and Bus speed, really is looking for more than just the hardware price. Especially when it comes to laptops.
This is also another reason why VW is still yielding net profits, even though they are more expensive than KIA, and only have a 50k mile warranty as opposed to 100k offered by KIA. Sometimes you just want the total experience…
For the record, I do have a Quad core AMD, 8 gigs of RAM, and an Nvidia GTX 260 running my main Linux desktop.
I have two laptops, one is an HP nc6400 with linux, the other.. well, a macbook pro, and it’s awesome.. I love it.
End of the day, it’s all about personal preference really..
Great article, great discussion..
I recently had this discussion with a friend of mine, right after I purchased my first “PC” in nearly 10 years, a Toshiba Satellite.
“Why? I thought you were a Mac guy?!” my friends all asked. The answer is very simple: “This Toshiba has vaguely comparable power to your MacBook Pro, but cost 520 $ instead of 2000 $.”
Sure, it came with Vista 32 bit (the Satellite L300 is a 64-bit machine), but it’s nothing a little Jaunty can’t cure.
(You might also be interested in this FOSS notebook http://egovsergo.com/2009/05/22/got-a-look-at-the-gdium-liberty-1000-at-fosslc/ )